and John French said "Who knows? Khayon is telling the Inquisition what they want to hear in an attempt to manipulate them in some way. To add a spoiler to one of your comments, simply wrap it in exclamation marks and arrows, Rule 4: No Memes, shitposts, or low-effort posts/comments. That's why we're here, isn't it? [–]Thousand SonsWheresMyCrown 1 point2 points3 points 2 years ago (1 child). This might be a perspective thing but as fans we only have the evidence/lore we have to go on. So do most of the narrators when they are talking to each other, but we are supposed to believe that everyone in the setting is an unreliable narrator, so. Just finished Black Legion, which was great, and one of my favorite little throwaways was the fact that Ahriman apparently no longer has a face, despite the fact that he believes he does. He's the one they hated for millennia, and the only one that can't see how deeply they're all screwed. [–]Thousand SonsWheresMyCrown 3 points4 points5 points 2 years ago (0 children). It'd numb you eventually! But the way GW is with representation, treating Persians, Egyptians and other middle eastern cultures like they are the same thing, it’s pretty likely that he is black or at least looks a beduin. [–]Imperium of ManChief_Jericho 1 point2 points3 points 2 years ago (0 children). That one Astartes may yet be the difference between our victory and defeat." It's at least somewhat metaphorical. [–][deleted] 16 points17 points18 points 2 years ago (5 children), I am buying green stuff and making a screaming void for his face, or taking one of the Blood Warriors from AoS with the giant mouth in the center of his chest and use that as a basis, [–]Adeptus MechanicusSpiritofTheWolfx 2 points3 points4 points 2 years ago (4 children). Also, he feels bad about mind-wiping an Emperor's Children captain that betrayed him and his troops during the Heresy. Don't get me wrong. Ha! I've read both of those books and I don't remember that line. In addition, if Abby's plan was to create the Cicatrix Maledictum, and Wrath strongly implies that the Sortiarius summoning helped, then Abaddon explicitly knew about what was going on with respect to Fenris. He has no idea that he's Tzeentch's favourite plaything - that he'll never be able to break free. Just your reminder that Ahzek Ahriman doesn't have a face any more (self.40kLore), submitted 2 years ago * by LamentersTheHuscarl. This is patently false and just Khayon throwing shade at Ahriman like he always does. [–]WarmasterAaron_Dembski-Bowden 11 points12 points13 points 2 years ago (6 children). Second, everything Khayon does is for a cause greater than himself while everything that Ahriman does is for his own power. Rule 9: No excerpts from a novel (novellas/short stories excluded) released within the last 30 days, so that there is time for others to read it. Yes, he throws shade. How is that not a retcon of the opening stages? Failure to do so may result in investigation by the Inquisition. 3K Views. Because of this early political alliance, Ahriman's tribes were largely spared the horrors of the atomic wars and proto-Astartes invasions of the Unification W… Anyone here realizing the subject here is Tzeentch and his minions? And the entirety of Atlas Infernal takes place in the opening stages of the 13th Black Crusade. It's worth noting that ADB's description of Ahriman, while not necessarily correct or literal (Khayon is an unreliable narrator after all), also does not really contradict the Ahriman trilogy. Implying anything is definitive is pretty much the only way to be wrong in stuff like this. Abaddon the Despoiler unites the fractious Traitor Legions in preparation for his Thirteenth Black Crusade. Couldn't dust-Ahriman make a Psyker illusion of his face? like Ichneumon, Menkaura and Sariq. Ahriman does have a face, he just manifests the illusion of a screaming void. I was doing some reading but came to almost the opposite conclusions to you interestingly enough. She’s actively hiding, and in the heart of the Eye she suffers greatly to the point she’s described as close to death, with no form of torture healing her etc. Ahzek Ahriman vs. Arthas Menethil. [–]Astral KnightsPaladin-Arda 9 points10 points11 points 2 years ago (7 children). Real talk brothers, Ahzek Ahriman doesn't have a face. It's not important but it adds flavor. Ahriman does have a face, Khayon is just being insulting/unreliable/a Thousands Sons sorcerer. It's why his story is a tragedy, and it's what makes him interesting. It's the stance I take myself: there's no real answer here, either way. Edit: I did spell anymore wrong in the title and it was an intentional effort to spread madness on Tzeentch's behalf. [–]kaptaintrips86 0 points1 point2 points 2 years ago (0 children). [–][deleted] 72 points73 points74 points 2 years ago (19 children). Without a face? Why even debate when we know that there isn't an answer? Heeeee. Persian, basically. Feel free to offer your own opinion on the OP however. Depending on how much you enjoy BL maybe grab the first novel Exile then go from there. I'm confused about what people mean by this. Khayon's just being mildly hyperbolic because he's jelly that Ahriman's a better space wizard. Please don't use this as a platform to promote your blog, crowdfunding, or anything of the ilk. And Ahriman’s face being a screaming void is like cranking that up to 11. I especially dig some of your interpretations of it. Full stop. It sheds light on his exile, discovering his purpose, and his struggle against destiny. Khayon's just being mildly hyperbolic because he's jelly that Ahriman's a better space wizard. I love you ADB and I love this context, thank you! To quote someone else I'm telling you information from behind-the-scenes as to why a different depiction in a novel is not so easily dismissed. Everything wont ever be known entirely. The idea of Ahriman simply melting his own face off from all the insane knowledge he has gathered, but not even noticing is still a cool concept. Discussion threads/comments are welcome but must be appropriately marked with spoiler tags and have no revealing information in the post title. Rule 4b: Do not post just links (YouTube, Imgur, Bell of Lost Souls, etc). I really hope we get more info on the thunder warriors too. The Dark Angels and Space Wolves aren't there until the final battles on Cadia. How is that not a retcon of the opening stages? Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy. Nowadays he probably looks nothing like a human being, his face must change all the time. Ahzek Ahriman. Rule 6: No real-world politics. In my mind the events of Atlas Infernal fit best best right at the start of the 13th BC, as this gives Ahriman plenty of time to set up his forces for both the events of the novel and his later ambush on the Ynnari. [–]kaptaintrips86 0 points1 point2 points 2 years ago (3 children). The entire narrative has been changed. Neither of the sons of the Anathema serve them willingly, both despise their masters. 7th option: this is one of the ways Ahriman appears to folks with the second sight. Clutching his Black Staff the Chaos sorcerer waved a palm at the Great Harlequin. Ahriman takes the identity of an Inquisitor in order to kidnap him in the confusion of everything else that's going on, but Czevak is rescued by the Harlequins and taken to the Black Library, which he eventually escapes from with the Atlas Infernal. So unaltered? It's not true, but it's interesting - I can see Ahriman thinking it, for example, while being blind to his own mutations. Doesn't Ahriman get his face and body etc. Khayon sees Ahriman's changes as that screaming void (thanks, John!) It's fun to discuss, but unimportant enough that it doesn't affect the enjoyment. And that flows into your second point Khayon doesn't need a cause he needs a leader. As a counter-argument I'd point towards Tolkien's work where sometimes an answer isn't explicited anywhere (such as what exactly Tom Bombadil is) but we do know that there is an answer and may argument about it. Which of course means Wrath also has to take place relatively early in the 13th Black Crusade, and may have fit into Abaddon's plans as "have Morty and Magnus keep the Wolves busy long enough for me to get a good foothold on/over Cadia." Rule 7: Official lore and fan fiction/fluff are welcome, but posting screenshots of official Games Workshop and/or Black Library material is not allowed. for using unreliable narrators. He's there of his own free will, presumably, either traveling to or from Nemesis Tessera, but is leery of other Inquisitors wanting a piece of him given that he's famous. he's definitely referring to a literal void, not a figurative insult. [–]Kaoshosh 13 points14 points15 points 2 years ago (3 children). ", [–]Ryans4427 1 point2 points3 points 2 years ago (3 children), [–]Imperial FistsChrodoskan -1 points0 points1 point 2 years ago (2 children), [–]Ryans4427 2 points3 points4 points 2 years ago (1 child). Ahriman's mind is a fortress that plays games with itself. That's what I'm saying. It's actually well within canon for Khayon to do that. Khayon is very much the definition of an unreliable narrator. Ahriman has a face, but his body's juiced-out on warp energy so his skin has a kaleidoscopic effect going on. Not even close. I am still not sure how the dark eldar lasted so long with slannesh follower's swarming the eye of terror. ", [–]eleventhPrimarch 0 points1 point2 points 2 years ago (1 child). Take a look at the Eye of Terror codex and you'll find that Czevak's abduction was a significant part of the overall prologue to the 13th Black Crusade. The sorcerer brought his clawed fingers up to the exposed tendons and roasted muscle before tearing the robes from his ancient, muscular frame. Rule 1: Be respectful. +I am not here because I tried to kill you. There doesn't have to be answers to everything and one of the issues with the HH is how it's over-explained some of it to detrimental effect. "No. Space Wizard Fight!!! I always thought it was touching how much Khayon cared for his rubrics, actually taking risks to save them and being very moved to hear them speak one last time. I have seen it... [–]LamentersTheHuscarl[S] 0 points1 point2 points 2 years ago (0 children). I didn't make it bloodlusted for a reason. Please also do not post/discuss things that are generally off-topic to 40k lore. [–]BrotherAhzek 6 points7 points8 points 2 years ago (2 children). Assuming that the worst (for everyone else) theories regarding the Tyranid Hive size are true, would/could we ever see a totally united galaxy to fight back against them? I like to think that Ahriman simply dusted himself after feeling guilty that he did the same to most of his brothers when he cast the Rubric. Please review. Ahriman has been one of Warhammer 40,000’s most notorious villains for decades, and now he has a brand new model. Nothing in those books is about petty "He sucks"-ness. Ahzek Ahriman is Alpharius, it is the only logical explanation! I wouldn't necessarily take what any of his characters say in-universe at face value or as objective truths. Because it might be overwritten now, [–]Adeptus Administratumjareddm 0 points1 point2 points 2 years ago (3 children). Yep. Sure lore can change(and feel free to tell John to write another Ahriman novel) but taking Khayon's opinion over an actual depiction in the novel is stretching things. I responded in kind but left it more open at the end that something was going on and gave my own theory on it. Ahriman I thought from reading his novels see it but just rejects it deluded yes but he can make you believe him in, make you want to believe. These assaults still happened, so if the novels had been removed from the 'canon' then I would be very surprised. Psykers perceive them as hideous and decayed. Wiz: *Sigh* Yes Boomstick, and is also the most powerful sorcerer of the Thousand Sons Legion after Magnus the Red. Join Facebook to connect with Ahzek Ahriman and others you may know. This things together leave very little time for Ahriman to be involved with the storylines in Atlas Infernal honestly. [–]White ScarsZyrael77 1 point2 points3 points 2 years ago (4 children), [–]BrotherAhzek 1 point2 points3 points 2 years ago (1 child), https://www.blacklibrary.com/all-products/ahriman-collection-ebook.html. See, this is where Tzeentch-level fuckery becomes the breeding ground for great characters and plot. Just saying, totally possible his face is actually a void. His psychic "face" is now a screaming void despite his claims to be independent. [–]TyranidsTyranid_Swarmlord 3 points4 points5 points 2 years ago (0 children), [–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 2 years ago (1 child). That's the point. It could be true, it could not be true. Please don't use this as a platform to promote your blog, crowdfunding, or anything of the ilk. He probably thinks he looks just like he always did. There are other subreddits for that. [–]72killertomato 11 points12 points13 points 2 years ago (1 child), Yeah but this is Khayon stuck in the Imperial Dungeon in 999.M41, [–]TyranidsTyranid_Swarmlord 4 points5 points6 points 2 years ago (0 children). [–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 2 years ago (0 children), [–]BrotherAhzek 0 points1 point2 points 2 years ago (1 child). 13:22. I think this selling Khayon a little short. He's accurately explaining Ahriman's delusions and flaws, explicitly, in the passage the OP is quoting. He probably thinks he looks just like he always did. This is from the Imperial Infantryman's Handbook which I purchased recently. They basically described as just empty husks/automatons that are controlled by another Sorcerer. The opening stages absolutely were. Learning what might have happened to old Nations. Well, I like that kind of writing myself, so it's still a victory to me. The battle for Cadia has completely changed in its entirety, as presented in Fall of Cadia. Rule 8: Posts containing novel excerpts must be supported by at least a paragraph describing why this moment is important, be it a grand revelation in the lore or a critical turning point in a character design. I'm not one of the people who thinks the Emperor is heartless and uncaring, either which is something a lot of people took away from that book, somehow. Yeah, I understand why he does it. The entirety of the Thousand Sons are at Fenris in the opening stages of the Crusade. [–]Representative of the InquisitionxSPYXEx 27 points28 points29 points 2 years ago (4 children). Ahriman's capacity for self-delusion is endless. He might be. 1. If you go through and look at everything he says about Ahriman it becomes obvious that it isn't just one little barb, it's an overwhelming hatred that colours his thoughts. Ahzek Ahriman: Once a loyal servant of the Emperor of Man, Ahriman has fallen to Chaos, and become the most powerful sorcerer of the Thousand Sons Traitor Legion. 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